For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Christine Nyn »

Something that Oren might be able to explain, or perhaps take a look at:

On first entry to a megaworld things seem pretty much as normal, textures load, scripted stuff seems to be running, movement of the avatar is OK etc but if you TP out and back or need to relog that is when some of the very large delays (which seem like an outright stop and failure if you aren't incredibly patient) occur.

All you see while the delay is sorting itself out is water, not even the land surface shows. Which leads me to wonder if anything could be done to render a world progressively in some way. I had assumed that this would happen automatically if i reduced the draw distance in my viewer but that didn't have the expected effect so clearly there is something else going on.

Tessiner was the region I was visiting, and I checked my viewer and internet connection were sound by visiting some other Kitely regions, both 4 x 4 and smaller, where I had no problems whatever.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Christine,

Worlds download progressively, the problem with Tessin is that in some places it requires your viewer to download thousands of unique assets (meshes, textures) before it can fully render your view. The viewer tries to download multiple assets at a time and if they don't have good LOD versions available then those assets can require a lot of data to be downloaded before even their lowest LOD version can be rendered. Similarly, downloading many assets at a time slows down how long it takes each asset to be downloaded, which causes the world to seem empty until objects start appearing. In other words, this world might look great when it's loaded from the viewer cache but for it to be in the cache it first needs to be downloaded by the viewer and in some locations a lot more needs to be downloaded than in others (the distribution of assets in that world isn't uniform).

To be clear, this is just an example of a world that could use optimization and that is true for most worlds that people create. Content optimization is very important if you want to have good performing worlds. It doesn't matter how powerful our system is if people's computer's aren't going to give your world's visitors a good experience because it takes too long to download all the content you've put in your worlds or you've positioned it in ways that create scenes that take a long time for people's graphics cards to render.

We'll investigate how we can improve the user experience when people enter worlds that aren't already cached in their viewer but please keep in mind that we're already sending out assets as quickly as the viewer asks for them and the asset downloads are already very fast because we use CloudFront, Amazon's CDN, to host and deliver the asset files that people download.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Scurvy Ragu 2 »

I just rented land from Trouble Ahead and i cant set home or play my URL music.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

I've no idea how MegaWorlds load (nor even how Opensim loads, for that matter), but it's been my experience that if ones viewer is overwhelmed, the Draw Distance is too high. A world may have tens of thousands of assets, but to my understanding the viewer doesn't load all of those at once (correct me please if I'm mistaken); it only loads those within your DD, and within your field of view. (In other words, it doesn't load assets that are directly behind you, but does within X degrees of your forward vision.)

If a world is so impacted that it drags down the viewer-- as is sometimes the case with shopping malls and their hundreds / thousands of textures and objects within visible distance-- I turn my DD down (sometimes to 64m). As a result the experience immediately improves.

I'm not doubting there may be some things in Megaregions that may need tweaked, or that Tessin doesn't have some major assets going on. It's just that unless that number of assets are absurdly huge, limiting draw distance to 256 or 128 may be the answer. (Again, if I'm not aware of something here, my toes won't be stepped on if someone clarifies.) :)
Last edited by Snoots Dwagon on Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Christine Nyn »

Thank you Ilan,
To be clear, this is just an example of a world that could use optimization and that is true for most worlds that people create. Content optimization is very important if you want to have good performing worlds. It doesn't matter how powerful our system is if people's computer's aren't going to give your world's visitors a good experience because it takes too long to download all the content you've put in your worlds or you've positioned it in ways that create scenes that take a long time for people's graphics cards to render.
I totally agree that optimised regions give a better all round experience. What I find puzzling in the specific case of Tessiner (and I did clear this with Trouble and she's OK with me commenting on it) is that essentially what has been done there is to recreate the 4x4 she was previously using as an 8x8 megaregion with the almost sole aim of acquiring more water for sailing. The scripts, textures, mesh etc worked perfectly OK in the 4x4 version of Tessiner - I know as I've done a lot of work there this year - so why would they not work in exactly the same way on the new 8x8 ?

You'd tend to think that as an 8x8 gets its own unshared virtual machine the performance should be better when the content is virtually identical. Hopefully if there are in fact any issues arising from the implementation of the larger areas they can be tracked down and fixed fairly quickly.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Christine Nyn »

Snoots Dwagon wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:38 pm
I've no idea how MegaWorlds load (nor even how Opensim loads, for that matter), but it's been my experience that if ones viewer is overwhelmed, the Draw Distance is too high.
That was something I'd found puzzling. Reducing my draw distance didn't seem to have any effect.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

Christine Nyn wrote:
Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:40 pm
...essentially what has been done there is to recreate the 4x4 she was previously using as an 8x8 megaregion with the almost sole aim of acquiring more water for sailing. The scripts, textures, mesh etc worked perfectly OK in the 4x4 version of Tessiner - I know as I've done a lot of work there this year - so why would they not work in exactly the same way on the new 8x8 ?
I was wondering this myself Christine. I didn't know if items had been added to Tessin or not... but prior to switching to a MegaWorld I never noticed any lag or performance issues. Now if a lot of assets had been added to the new MegaWorld it would be understandable performance might be affected (especially if some of those assets were badly behaved). But if it's the same Tessin... one would think performance would increase significantly on a dedicated server.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Scurvy,

Buying land hasn't been implemented in Kitely yet (it will be very soon) so you as a renter can't own the land yet. As such you can't use functions that are only available to the world owner, Estate Managers or parcel owners. What Trouble can do is assign a parcel to a group, invite you to that group and then give that group permissions to set home and change the music URL. That will enable you to use those functions now.
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

Well the good news on Tessin:

I spoke to Trouble and she said it was the same Tessin... nothing added. So was right there. But apparently there was an external-server based script to handle an on-world game she had running, and it was specifically designed for the old Tessin (I don't have all the details. I'll let Trouble provide those.) But she removed that system. I visited Tessin this evening. Teleport was very quick and I flew all over. Noticed no "sluggish" at all, no lag.

So just goes to prove what many of us already know to be true: one bad script can cripple a region. (Not saying the script was bad... just that the script wasn't written to adapt to a new world server. Which well, that's not good, but...) ;D
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Re: For a limited time only: get a huge 64-region Mega World running on a dedicated server for just $99.95/month

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Scurvy and Christine,

It's possible that Tessin includes additional scripts that were designed with a smaller world size in mind and that are therefore causing a lot of load on the server now that they're running on a world that is 4 times bigger than what it was when it was an Advanced World. If Xengine (OpenSim's script engine) is stressing the server that can slow down anything else that OpenSim needs to handle.

The built up land in Tessin is currently much bigger than it was when that world was a quarter of the size (as can be seen in the world map) so I'm not sure what Trouble means when she says it's the same now as it was when it was running as an Advanced World.
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