Questions and Frusterations

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Dagon Xanith
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Questions and Frusterations

Post by Dagon Xanith »

I joined at end of month last month but I couldn't figure out how to get login. I lost my sign in bonus minutes.
I paid something to kitely but I realize what I wanted.
I am also bit frustrated by how even in areas I assumed was free it wasn't.
The times I have logged out and looked at time I keep getting minutes taken from me.
I have looked I have double checked.
I am frusterated.
So because I gave my credit info via paypal to kitely are you guys going to automatically charge me.
I meant to actually get more minutes so I work on my projects but select wrong thing.
Now I am pissed.
What even more annoying is I just paid you guys 25 dollars when building tools don't even work correctly.
Please tell me you're not going to automatically take minutes from me even when I am logged out and bill me every month for this especially when the things dragging prims and copying them don't seem to work.

Example of what I am frusterated about I paid for the Bronze plan which is 30 hours but I only have listed 1210 minutes
that doesn't make sense.
Example of transactions:

10-Nov-2013 05:05


User Visit Dagon Xanith Dagon hideout 15 minutes 15




10-Nov-2013 05:03 Bronze Plan 1176 ( I wanted 30 hours but your site refused to give me 30 hours I got only 1176 minutes I should have more)









10-Nov-2013 04:57 Bought Credits 5000 (what I wanted but was confused about was time I wanted to pay for the minutes not credits.)

10-Nov-2013 03:52


User Visit


Dagon Xanith


Welcome Center 1:00 hours 60 ( so I waste 60 minutes somewhere I thought I could hang out for free:( that is pretty close to empty)



Plus 4 minutes more

10-Nov-2013 03:45 User Visit


Dagon Xanith Welcome Center 4 minutes 4







10-Nov-2013 03:43
User Visit




Dagon Xanith


Dagon's Testing Hideout


3 minutes


3




10-Nov-2013 03:38


User Visit


Dagon Xanith


Dagon's Testing Hideout


4 minutes


4




31-Oct-2013 17:05


Free Plan
120

I only used 71 minutes before I went bronze. I hadn't logged into anything I had 120 minutes.
What the hell happen to 59 minutes.
Why can't I just pay for 30 hours and actually use them?

time don't add up or subtract up. Seriously.
I could make lot of great things here but this is really annoying. :(

While I understand you the creators of this grid had to go through major programing hell to get world up and working, plus all the other cost but this doesn't settle right.
Can I cancel my account?
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Ilan Tochner
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Dagon,

A lot of questions, I'll try to address them all. Please let me know if I missed any.

First, we never get your credit card information. That is kept by PayPal which bills you and then transfers money to us. You can change your plan (and the associated PayPal subscription) at any time by using the Change plan link in our Settings page. When you upgrade your plan your payment is pro-rated (so you don't pay the full price of the plan if you don't order on the first of the month) and so is the amount of Minutes you get. You were shown the pro-rated charge in the Change Plan confirmation dialog. Once you upgraded from the Free Plan to the Bronze Plan the pro-rated amount of Minutes was added to your account. You can see that transaction in your account's History page.

If you downgrade a plan during the month then, since you already paid for it, you will retain the previous plan's Minutes and free worlds quota until the beginning of the following month. See our Services page for details. When you change plans you are sent to PayPal to create a new PayPal subscription to replace the one you're just canceling. Once the new subscription is created our system automatically informs PayPal to cancel the previous subscription (when you downgrade to the Free Plan the PayPal subscription may be canceled immediately without first creating a new subscription to replace it as the Free Plan doesn't require recurring payment).

Our system automatically charges you Kitely Credits instead of Minutes when you visit a time-based billing world and have no Minutes left in your account. You can determine whether a world is free access by going to its world page and looking at the Enter World button. If it has the word FREE below it then you won't be charged Minutes or Kitely Credits for access. See for example: http://www.kitely.com/virtual-world/Ila ... ome-Center

We are aware that a lot of people get confused by how the time-based billing worlds work and are working to replace that system with one which enables people who visit other people's worlds to do so without paying for time inworld. For details, please see: http://www.kitely.com/forums/viewtopic. ... =857#p6117

There are many people building in Kitely so I'm sure that if you gave me a bit more information about the building problems you're encountering I could help you resolve them.

Are you willing to give Kitely another chance?
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Dagon Xanith
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Dagon Xanith »

Sorry I am just fricking grumpy and I am totally want to build/create but I just don't have much more to spend.
I was mad at myself.
But good thing is all of this has motivated me figure sim on stick, thank you sim on stick creator dude.
Lost my bonus subscription join in time because I couldn't viewer to work.
I found another eventually worked for me.
Logged in was only hour the system said you you took whole 120 minutes.
I tried to buy 30 hours I end buying wrong thing and when I did figure out the minutes I couldn't get the whole 30 hours.
I was stuck with only 1210 minutes so basically I lost 590 minutes.
This system is really confusing. I kept thinking am I missing something?
Any way you 25 dollars from me whether or not able to use it or not. I wonder if credits run out too like your time system.
It really seems not very fair to not even get to be able use the time we pay for have run out faster than we actually use it.
There got better way to get your server charges paid.
Seems like lot hassle for not be able to shell 40 dollars a month.
As far the building,
I was attempting to drag and copy and prims that didn't work no prims were copied.
Nobody was around for miles and lag was major.
Try to upload texture, kept crashing.
Finally got it after about five attempts.
I think I am just burned out I have doing second life plus other beta world places that charge off and on since in 2003 and I just don't pay any more for beta.
Sorry.
I may stop back by but I want to place to create stuff and improve my skills with minimal hassles.
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Ilan Tochner
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Dagon,

Have you tried using the viewer we recommend people use (the OpenSim-compatible version of Firestorm, not the SL-only version of that viewer)? Please see: http://www.kitely.com/startviewers

We didn't charge you $25, we charged you $20 when you bought 5000 KC and another $3.50 when you updated from the Free Plan to the Bronze Plan. You were only charged a pro-rated amount for the remaining days in the month and were therefore given a correspondingly pro-rated amount of Minutes. I understand your frustration but please remember that you didn't lose 590 Minutes as you haven't paid for those 590 Minutes - you were charged a lower price than the full monthly cost of the plan. Had you remained on that plan, you would have been charged the full rate at the begging of next month and would have received the full month's quota as a result.

Minutes expire at the end of each Month. Kitely Credits do not expire and will remain in your account until you use them.

I agree the system can be confusing at first and while people eventually understand how our system works (and the benefits that it provides) we want to remove that complexity so there is no confusion. The link I gave you in my previous reply contains a description of our plan for addressing this problem.

You attempted to drag prims from where to where?

There are about 5000 user regions in Kitely and they are spread out over a large amount of ocean, from our logs it looks like you spent most of your time in your own private world where other people can't enter. If you want to meet other people please go to the Public Worlds page and press one of the world names you see at the top of the page. Then press the Enter World button in the world page that opens.

If you kept crashing while attempting to upload an asset then you experienced viewer problems that can be resolved by switching to Firestorm or Singularity (for example).

You'll find that many people are very happy with our performance and stability, but you have to use a modern version of a v3 viewer if you wish to avoid various viewer-related problems.
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Dagon Xanith
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Dagon Xanith »

The frustrating part of it was I got that backwards I wanted the time.
I had really hard time getting kitely to work with phoenix because I use it for second life.
What worked for me getting into the world was Kokua.
Anyway good luck with this world.
For opensource world 40 dollars and 1 sim is pretty affordable consider what other worlds are charging for server space.
I just can't afford it.:(
And the way time system works and how confusing it is that just what little I have experienced of it is becoming stressful option.
I am not sure what I am going to do I don't really like time plan personally and I am already paying all what little disposable income I have towards my budget is going to Adobe Creative cloud.
And now with meshes I am going to have think some affordable way to learn how to get something equivalent to Blender but more user friendly but won't cost three thousands of dollars to own like Maya.
I just don't have the 40 a month to spare for unlimited time in your world.
Visiting other people when I got time limit and want to create in world seems bit expensive when that comes out of my minutes and way it going it seems like every minute in world 2 minutes are taken where ever I go.
Which doesn't seem fair.
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Dot Matrix
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Re: Questions and Frustrations

Post by Dot Matrix »

Dagon, there are free worlds to visit that don't use up your minutes, including sandboxes. In these, the world managers subsidise visitors.

Another option (if you are on a limited budget like some of us are here) is to buy some KC: http://www.kitely.com/settings

Just $5 buys 1,000 KC, and that will give you 16+ hours in world to create in your own free region. If you can afford $20 or even $50, you get a discount on the KC, so $20 gets you 5,000 KC (83+ hours) and $50 buys 15,000 KC (250 hours!).

The KC don't expire each month. So if you buy them when you can afford them, you can use them to pay for your time in Kitely as you go.

I know from experience that this "pay as you go" method works. It is extremely flexible and affordable, and helps those on limited incomes to have fun and create in their own free full region.
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Dagon Xanith
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Dagon Xanith »

Hmm I thought the "Welcome Center" was free and didn't take from my minutes.
I was wrong.
Thanks Dot. I did pay for some time and credits. I am just bit confused about it.
Along with few other things as always like Mesh,Oars, Iars, Blender and few other things my brain can't rezz. LOL
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Ilan Tochner
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Dagon,

I looked at your history log. You entered a user-manged world called welcome center, but it wasn't Kitely's official welcome center.

The world you entered was this one: http://www.kitely.com/virtual-world/Mik ... ome-Center

Kitely's official welcome center is this world: http://www.kitely.com/virtual-world/Ila ... ome-Center

Please note that there is a FREE label below the Enter World button in our official world and that there is no such label below the user-managed world you entered (which is why it consumed minutes from your account).

Please also note that we're considering changing our pricing model to allow getting unlimited free access worlds for less than $40/month. See: http://www.kitely.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=857
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Constance Peregrine »

Dagon Xanith wrote:Hmm I thought the "Welcome Center" was free and didn't take from my minutes.
I was wrong.
Thanks Dot. I did pay for some time and credits. I am just bit confused about it.
Along with few other things as always like Mesh,Oars, Iars, Blender and few other things my brain can't rezz. LOL
heck, you're doin' better than me then...my brain can't even rezz!!!
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Re: Questions and Frusterations

Post by Dundridge Dreadlow »

Kitely takes a bit of getting used to and a bit of effort to learn what works best for you.
Even at the highest price level of Kitely, it is still significantly cheaper than "other" options.
Plus you get access to all the shiny servers :)

Even on it's worst day, Kitely is still better :D

..as to mesh.. personally I use 3DS Max (which is a little on the expensive side) and a lot of people use Milkshape or Blender. There are a few mid price tools available, but most of the tools are aimed firmly at the 3D professional end. There are student versions of max/maya available if you meet the criteria.
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