How do we donate avatars?

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Ada Radius
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Ada Radius »

Snoots Dwagon wrote:
Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:15 pm
A thought or two on that. When LL first introduced "avatar complexity" as a concept, for some reason there were those of us who didn't trust that figure and wondered if this was just another stunt by the company to blame lag on users instead of where it rightly belonged: badly-written bottleneck code and over-stacking servers. [/quote]

Yes, and it works differently in OS and with more recent viewers. My tests show that unnecessarily dense topology is a bad idea, also improperly set LOD, too many textures - total pixels, too many alpha textures, too many flexies. Off the shelf and freebie wigs are the worst offenders. I keep my graphics set low to gauge viewer load on stuff I make.

Consequences for bad stuff are that the wearer will appear as a jelly for some people. We know from doing theatrical events that we had to make low-poly, low texture avatars for the actors so we could get audience, who come to be seen as well as to see, into the sim, along with a good house manager to deal with the most egregious. In Kitely we have nifty brower based tools to keep track of sim performance, and ya, avatars, avatars and wait for it, avatars are hard on servers as well as viewers.

No perfect tests or solutions. BUT we ain't gonna want to see high avatar complexity numbers on the freebie avatars.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

Yeah Ada, I hear you about the hair and flexy dresses. Many years ago I remember seeing one hair that had some 250 flexy prims... just below the link limit. Was it great hair? You bet.. if you could move your avatar to see it. (This was in old SL days.) Probably these days it wouldn't be as bad, but creators often seem to have no concept of the impact flexys have when used in number.


Know what would be fun Ada? To run a really complex test. Find 50 volunteer avatars and dress them all in basic no-prim paint-on clothing (wearing textures basically) and take some sim stat readings. Then have the same users wear their favorite avatars, no-holds barred. Once they actually manage to get those avatars to rez (I figure a half hour might do)... check the sim stats to see if it has any measurable effect. Then walk around and see if their presence has any effect Viewer side (ie, can we still walk?).

That would be a fun test. Right? :mrgreen:

Would be informative. Except that we already know: 50 full-bore avatars are gonna cause some lag. I'm just curious how much.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Ilan Tochner »

It's not just lag snoots. If people need to download 50 avatars that each use just 10 MB of assets then they'll need to download 500MB of assets just for the avatars and, as explained in a different forums post, that can cause viewer cache thrashing issues. To recap, people's viewer cache sizes are usually just a few gigabytes in size and some worlds already contain gigabytes worth of assets that viewers need to download in order to completely rezz them. Adding overly complex avatars to the mix is only going to make things worse.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Ilan Tochner »

Hi Ada,

Content creators who wish to help grow the Kitely community by donating some of their creations, like Snoots is proposing, are welcome to do so. Growing the community helps grow the customer base for people's Kitely Market stores and that can help increase their revenue. Especially, if what they give out serves like a form of advertising for their full product (again, like Snoots described above). The selected donations will also be mentioned in the Kitely blog post that covers this update with links to the related, non-free, variations of those avatars in Kitely Market.

Other than that, we're not going to pay for those avatars ourselves nor will we offer any guarantee that donating them will help your sales. If we do it for this then we'll need to start doing it for other community contributions as well, and that will result in us avoiding accepting any community help due to all the liabilities that it would create for us. People who find that objectionable should simply not donate to this. It is in no way mandatory and we don't expect anyone to do so.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

Yes Ilan, as you mention I consider these donations to Kitely and don't expect payment or any other consideration. The only thing I'd ask is that I can include a notecard which would tell about Dwagons (the back story, how to wear them and such)... and of course its only sensible that notecard would contain my Kitely store link and Weefolk Township landmark. It's not that I expect much in the way of sales-- but directing people to the Market and to an active always-on World further helps Kitely. : )
Last edited by Snoots Dwagon on Mon Feb 15, 2021 1:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Ilan Tochner »

That's fine Snoots, but the notecard will need to be included in the content somewhere as there are some cases where the default avatar isn't delivered in a box.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Chris Namaste »

i really might need MORE than a week...
is it urgent now?
:'(
i plan to make classic system avatars,
igot so many ideas & things on pc
atm there are urgent matters in life (& kitely) i need to attend to as well,
can it please be longer than a week?
thaks
christa
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Because ultimately we are not the avatars we create. We are not the pictures on the film stock. We are the light that shines through.Jim Carrey
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Snoots Dwagon »

I don't think a time line has been mentioned, or donation method / presentation discussed. Currently it's just a call for creators who want to be involved to start planning on what they might want to do. The only reason I posted is because I already had two avatars that could be adapted to the cause. : )
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Ilan Tochner »

To accommodate people's schedules, let's aim for the end of the month for the first batch of donations. We'll then see how many contributions we've gotten and decide on next steps accordingly.
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Re: How do we donate avatars?

Post by Chris Namaste »

thankyou ilan,
ideas please :
would i start at child avatars (pg) or not?
if u think its,not what will be donated, ill focus on adult (pg) man & woman (pg)
thx for advice so idont make it for nothing:)
christa
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Because ultimately we are not the avatars we create. We are not the pictures on the film stock. We are the light that shines through.Jim Carrey
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