The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

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The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Ozwell Wayfarer » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:55 pm

So, everyone must have heard the general commotion being kicked up by the new SL TOS. I don't know what the hell they are thinking, but I can safely say as a creator that I wont be bringing any more products to market while that clause exists.

My immediate reaction was something along the lines of "well screw this, I guess I am off to Kitely for good!", but it got me thinking how this is one of those moments that comes along from time to time that can really help to leverage the message of the Opensim community. I already know about Kitely, so it is my natural choice. But I was talking to a fellow merchant last night and fount that although they know about Kitely, they are still stuck thinking the usual misconceptions about opensim in general.

When I told them the real deal, they were quite intrigued how professional and organized this service is becoming. In particular that you don't need to use the in-world currency if you don't want to.

The way I sell it is "Yes, its kind of like SL in 2005, which means there is opportunity to be found for people with talent and a first mover advantage for niche product makers. Don't you want to be in BEFORE the boom? Because from a merchant perspective, if there is any chance of recapturing the halcyon days of SL, Kitley is it. Even if it shines only half as bright, better that than this slow decline into oblivion. Yes, the users are not there YET, but hey, its SL in 2005, right? ;) and I have far more faith in the Kitely team than I ever had in LL. They deliver what they promise". Usually I am met with begrudging curiosity :)

So I would encourage anyone with any connections to creators in SL to get back in there and get talking to them. This latest incident has given many pause for serious reflection, and this is when people are most open to new ideas.
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Constance Peregrine » Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:13 pm

There are, as you know some of, many misconceptions about OS.

This is changing...however, some of it is also promoted by other closed commercial grids who have financial interests in holding their merchants, and content, inside their walls.

Kitely is the ONLY -current- exception to this mind-think, in several regards, which is why it continues to hold my own interest.

However, most of that is not of any use or needed to be said to creators coming from SL. Messages, as sound-bites that are everywhere nowadays prove, need to be concise and targeted towards the intended audience...and changed depending upon the target.

For purposes of content creators Kitely is really the only option, imo. One message being simply that due to their giving a free region to any resident, those residents need content to fill them.
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Ozwell Wayfarer » Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:38 pm

Agreed. Kitely for me is not about what it is now, but what it promises to become, and the Kitely team have never given me any reason to doubt their money is exactly where their mouth is.

and your right, that is another good point that I often drop.

They give you 100,000 prims in Kitely. There are less users, but all those users have at least one region that they want to fill with nice things. So each user has the potential to use nearly seven times more prims than a full sim owner in SL, and they are not spending 300 bucks a month just for some grass with some clouds and water :lol:. But I find you often need to point this stuff out for it to really sink in. People see the facts but dont think through the possible implications.

I know not everyone is in OS to be a consumer and many are just happy building. Thats why I love OS in general, it gives the user the chance to choose. In a world so rampantly money-centric as SL, commercialism will always be in your face because nearly all entertainment venues, art projects, etc NEED to monetize to survive, but OS give everyone the breathing space they need. I never got why people bicker about monetizing OS. We all know we can have both, right? :) that's why its so great.

For instance, in SL I have a homestead, but due to prims vs profit, all I can do is sell my stuff, and I am really not about marketing AT ALL. if you like my shit, great! If not.....oh well :). Here in Kitely, the price is right and prims are plentiful, meaning I can put my stuff up on the MP, and instead of an inworld store, make an RP sim like I always wanted. The sim will be full of stuff I designed, not for the purpose of selling it, but for the purpose of giving others enjoyment with it. Hopefully I will finish that next month and get the OAR uploaded :) and I love that I can do that here.

hmm. Slight digression from my original theme here..... :mrgreen:
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Constance Peregrine » Thu Sep 26, 2013 4:19 pm

Ozwell Wayfarer wrote:Agreed. Kitely for me is not about what it is now, but what it promises to become, and the Kitely team have never given me any reason to doubt their money is exactly where their mouth is.

and your right, that is another good point that I often drop.

They give you 100,000 prims in Kitely. There are less users, but all those users have at least one region that they want to fill with nice things. So each user has the potential to use nearly seven times more prims than a full sim owner in SL, and they are not spending 300 bucks a month just for some grass with some clouds and water :lol:. But I find you often need to point this stuff out for it to really sink in. People see the facts but dont think through the possible implications.

I know not everyone is in OS to be a consumer and many are just happy building. Thats why I love OS in general, it gives the user the chance to choose. In a world so rampantly money-centric as SL, commercialism will always be in your face because nearly all entertainment venues, art projects, etc NEED to monetize to survive, but OS give everyone the breathing space they need. I never got why people bicker about monetizing OS. We all know we can have both, right? :) that's why its so great.

For instance, in SL I have a homestead, but due to prims vs profit, all I can do is sell my stuff, and I am really not about marketing AT ALL. if you like my shit, great! If not.....oh well :). Here in Kitely, the price is right and prims are plentiful, meaning I can put my stuff up on the MP, and instead of an inworld store, make an RP sim like I always wanted. The sim will be full of stuff I designed, not for the purpose of selling it, but for the purpose of giving others enjoyment with it. Hopefully I will finish that next month and get the OAR uploaded :) and I love that I can do that here.

hmm. Slight digression from my original theme here..... :mrgreen:
Yes, I agree, and it is worth quoting in entirety I think-))

I believe there will be some hold back initially with all this while the uniqueness of the concept sinks in. I also believe that the attempts by other small closed commercial grids in their various backroom talks attempting to dissuade people from coming to Kitely, and to using the MP, will not hold water over time.

The merchants who wish to make money will come anyways. It is an inevitability.

I also love the option of blending both types of OS use and like that Kitely built in some of those functions. If they had not I would probably not be participating here at all.
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Ada Radius » Thu Sep 26, 2013 8:09 pm

Another OS benefit, and it's huge for designers, are FREE UPLOADS. It means I can make unlimited iterations of a texture, sculpty, animation, mesh, or sound, and when I'm finally happy, delete the drafts. Everything looks different on the grid than it did in PhotoShop or Blender or Max (different resolutions, color, lighting, depending on viewer and viewer settings) which was frustrating iSL, but turns out to be a feature in OS as we can also afford sims and therefore figure out lighting a whole lot better. iSL I could spend thousands of Lindens on that, and even using SOAS for drafts there were unpleasant surprises.
:)
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by ShowStopper Eclipse » Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:04 pm

What's changed with the SL TOS now?
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Keith Selmes » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:05 am

What's changed with the SL TOS now?
The new TOS section that caused the trouble
You agree to grant to Linden Lab, the non-exclusive, unrestricted, unconditional, unlimited, worldwide, irrevocable, perpetual, and cost-free right and license to use, copy, record, distribute, reproduce, disclose, sell, re-sell, sublicense (through multiple levels), modify, display, publicly perform, transmit, publish, broadcast, translate, make derivative works of, and otherwise exploit in any manner whatsoever, all or any portion of your User Content (and derivative works thereof), for any purpose whatsoever in all formats..
So CGtextures changed their own TOS to say "From 6 September 2013 you are no longer permitted to add our images to Second Life or other Linden Lab products"
http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2013/09/textur ... e-tos.html

Linden Lab (or their legal people) responded "We regret that our intention in revising our Terms of Service to streamline our business may have been misconstrued"
http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2013/09/linden ... tures.html

But LL haven't rephrased the new TOS, so some people are pulling their content anyway
http://nwn.blogs.com/nwn/2013/09/second ... r-tos.html

Whatever the truth, a lot of people are not satisfied with the reassurances from LL, and LL are not budging on the phrasing. Shot themselves in the foot, I think.
Probably won't have a huge impact, so many are comitted to SL, but once again there are long term SL users leaving due to a badly handled policy change, so another downward step for SL.
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Keith Selmes » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:09 am

And at New World Notes, Tuna Odfellow posted this
I am now in InWorldz setting up first a small club environment with particles and wonderment and then a new Odd Ball which will take on it's own shapes that SL will never see.

I am not asking you to leave SL but if you are a creator you might think twice.

I do challange you to expand your scope of the metaverse. Create an alt in InWorldz and other places. Learn OpenSim and HyperGriding.

I can only recreate my show because I have planned for this for years. Protect your art.


Hugs and Fishes,

Tuna
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Ilan Tochner » Fri Sep 27, 2013 12:31 am

Would be nice if people knew more about Kitely and Kitely Market. Should be easier to move content into OpenSim via Kitely than directly into other grids: we provide tools that help content creators ensure that their content has been recreated properly: http://www.kitely.com/virtual-world-new ... -products/
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Re: The new draconian SL TOS - A boon for opensim?

Post by Constance Peregrine » Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:03 am

That is insane.
Keith Selmes wrote:And at New World Notes, Tuna Odfellow posted this
I am now in InWorldz setting up first a small club environment with particles and wonderment and then a new Odd Ball which will take on it's own shapes that SL will never see.

I am not asking you to leave SL but if you are a creator you might think twice.

I do challange you to expand your scope of the metaverse. Create an alt in InWorldz and other places. Learn OpenSim and HyperGriding.

I can only recreate my show because I have planned for this for years. Protect your art.


Hugs and Fishes,

Tuna
Laissez faire et laissez passer, le monde va de lui même!
My little sounds store https://www.kitely.com/market?store=2040306

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