Kitely Forums

Thanks Ilan. I was trying to keep it simple for the sake of the discussion. The core point being that cost of business in Kitely is slightly higher while market size is markedly smaller. I agree with your points about the industry standard and while I cant say I like it of course, I would strongly expect LL to bring their MP commissions more in line with things like Turbosquid and/or App marketplaces going forward.

I would also say that from a customer POV, you get far less value for your money in most other 3D marketplaces Like Turbosquid, Falling Pixel or Renderosity. Second Lifes historically high tier depressed the price of virtual goods which I think ultimately hurt its economic growth in the long run.

I appreciate the breakdown of your pricing, Ozwell - very illuminating/educational. I hadn't really thought about the cost per piece, and how ridiculously low it is (and that's even with the higher export price), given the time and the skill involved in making them. Perhaps you're not charging enough! (Wait - did I just say that out loud? Eep!) But markup or no, I'll still buy your stuff, because I love it.

I really haven't had a problem with your prices - I wasn't trying to start a conversation about how much something costs, but was instead trying to talk more about the fact that creators (many? all? but NOT you specifically) charging us more for exportable items, versus non-exportable - because someone might steal it - doesn't seem very fair to the majority of honest buyers. I mean, anyone can log into any grid with a modified viewer and steal nearly anything they want, if they are of a mind to, and there's little to nothing anyone can do to stop them. So, if it can be stolen, whether it's exportable or not, it doesn't seem fair to charge one group of people more because they might steal it, and not charge another group as much, when anyone can steal it. Maybe everyone should be paying the higher price - at least it would seem more equitable. That's how it works in RL, for example - we *all* pay a higher price for goods, due to shoplifting. Everyone, not just a certain subset of buyers.

Shaun Emerald wrote:I really haven't had a problem with your prices - I wasn't trying to start a conversation about how much something costs, but was instead trying to talk more about the fact that creators (many? all? but NOT you specifically) charging us more for exportable items, versus non-exportable - because someone might steal it - doesn't seem very fair to the majority of honest buyers.

Sorry Shaun. I somehow felt alluded to. But either way I thought it was a good chance to illustrate the other side of this debate. As I said I am not seeking a rumble with anyone But its a topic I have seen doing the rounds and felt I should just say my peace. Most of what I said actually addressed points Danko raised.

I think the bit that got me was "But paying $15 for something, when the non-export version is $5, for example". I felt that referred to my trees, but sorry if I was wrong.

While I agree, passing on the cost of theft to the consumer does leave a bitter taste in the mouth, every RL business does this. A percentage of the cost you pay factors in the cost of goods that will likely be stolen. I am not trying to say "that's life, deal with it" or anything here, just illustrating that this is actually a very common practice for even very big corporations. Many creators barely even qualify as "a business" in terms of revenue. For the record, I don't consider this in my pricing at all. I just accept that in this world, some people steal and some don't.

My price for export is based on the fact that you can do much more with the items, and take them with you no matter how your plans change in regard to hosting. You can even upload the meshes to your own instance where you are listed as creator, then save out the DAE files with firestorm, including textures. From there, you can go to any virtual world present or future and use your purchases. You can model and retexture the meshes in external apps, create new meshes from my parts. So. Much. Stuff. Heck, I even encourage it! I think that amount of freedom is worth something. You might not need all that freedom right now, but its there for you, no matter how your plans change or your skills develop.

This is why I would like to see Kitely pioneer a system where it is easier to offer bonuses or discounts to selected customers. Though maybe I would be the only person using it

Another point to consider is people seem to think creators mark UP from the C/M price, but this is not always true. I ask what I think is a fair price for DRM free (export) items. I then offer the C/M versions at at least half price (plus available with KC, so you can save even more with the KC buyer discount) precisely because of the limitations imposed. I wanted to see one of my trees in every sim in Kitely, so I offer them well below what I think they are worth for Kitely-only use.

haha, Shaun........again this began addressed to you and quickly devolved into a long unfocused ramble. Apologies for my verbosity everyone.